Can you share with our readers the most interesting or amusing story that occurred to you in your career so far? Can you share the lesson or takeaway you took out of that story?

There are too many to mention but a few stand out. Firstly the power of showing up. To whatever it is your doing. 80% of success is based on showing up. The other 20% is a combination of luck, skill and timing.

Lastly be prepared as much as possible. My worst ever pitch was a face-to-face pitch presentation and right before the meeting my laptop died. I had no option but to go in and do the meeting without any backup. It was awful! Needless to say we didn’t win the project.

Are you working on any exciting new projects now? How do you think that will help people?

I’ve just finished my new book and we are out promoting that at the moment. Selling Creativity is out now and a guide for agencies and creatives to grow their business through the art of sales. It would also apply to most industries or businesses who want to learn more about the art of sales.

None of us are able to achieve success without some help along the way. Is there a particular person who you are grateful towards who helped get you to where you are? Can you share a story about that?

I’ve worked with some great people over the years, many of whom have been inspirational and brilliant mentors. Pete Stevenson and Phil Blundell at The Edge Picture Company deserve a mention. As do Gary Fitzpatrick and Angela Law for giving me my break into the industry.

Dave Holley also gave me my first job in the music industry, as Head of Business Development at Abbey Road Studios when I was just 27. Absolutely my dream job at the time and an incredible place to be a part of for a few years.

For the benefit of our readers, can you tell us a bit why you are an authority on the topic of sales?

Well I’ve spent over 25 years doing it. To date I’ve sold over £30M worth of creative services, films and content for my clients which averages at £1M per year. I’ve had lots of success with sales but also lots of failures along the way. That teaches you lots of lessons and how to improve. I decided to write the book to bring together all of that experience and knowledge in one place.

Ok. Thanks for all that. Let’s now jump to the main core of our interview. As you know, nearly any business a person will enter, will involve some form of sales. At the same time, most people have never received any formal education about how to be effective at selling. Why do you think our education system teaches nearly every other arcane subject, but sales, one of the most useful and versatile topics, is totally ignored?

Well firstly, most education systems are flawed anyway and rapidly becoming out of date. We really don’t tend to think of sales in a very positive way. In the book there is a chapter called Sales needs a Rebrand. We need to reframe the way we see it in a more positive light. The negative stereotypical view has taken hold over many decades. Therefore sales is not held in the same high regard as a lawyer, banker or a doctor. Which is a shame because if you think about the business, and economic contribution great sales people make, it’s huge! Literally billions of dollars around the world every day, contributing to people’s livelihoods. Yet we still think it is a negative thing. Madness.

This discussion, entitled, “How To Be Great At Sales Without Seeming Salesy”, is making an assumption that seeming salesy or pushy is something to be avoided. Do you agree with this assumption? Whether yes, or no, can you articulate why you feel the way you do?

I do, yes. Great sales people are never salesy and they are never, ever pushy. It’s simply not part of what we do or how things work. Sales is essentially about trying to understand people first and foremost. Do their needs align with you or your business? Forget trying to sell people something and just try to talking to them for a while. That’s the way you build rapport and interest that will then lead to sales.

The seven stages of a sales cycle are usually broken down to versions of Prospecting, Preparation, Approach, Presentation, Handling objections, Closing, and Follow-up. Which stage do you feel that you are best at? What is your unique approach, your “secret sauce”, to that particular skill? Can you explain or give a story?

Well those are all key parts of the process and I am comfortable with each one. You sometimes have to prioritise different areas at any one time. For example, we spend a lot of time prospecting (or qualifying) because we only want to engage people who are right and likely to buy. You can lose so much time if you don’t do this key step. I also love the presentation side (or pitch) as that is where the creative ideas are usually shared and it’s often make or break time!

Lead generation, or prospecting, is one of the basic steps of the sales cycle. Obviously, every industry will be different, but can you share some of the fundamental strategies you use to generate good, qualified leads?

Lead generation is where it all starts. Without any leads you don’t have any sales and so it’s pretty crucial to get right! It has changed significantly in the last few years. When I started selling most of it was done on the phone. Now almost none of it is done on the phone! There are many tools and pieces of tech that can help you generate more inbound leads. The key is to develop a plan and method for a regular consistent stream of enquiries of potential customers.

In my experience, I think the final stages of Handling Objections, Closing, and Follow-up, are the most difficult parts for many people. Why do you think ‘Handling Objections’ is so hard for people? What would you recommend for one to do, to be better at ‘Handling Objections’?

I have a simple answer. Ask more questions… at the start. You do not want to get into a situation where you have done all of the work, at your expense, only to lose the project and be faced with a barrage of objections. The more you can clarify upfront what it is the client is looking to achieve and have the conversation, the more successful you will be.

‘Closing’ is of course the proverbial Holy Grail. Can you suggest 5 things one can do to successfully close a sale without being perceived as pushy?

Timing is everything in sales. Go too hard, too early and you’ll lose. Too late and the moment has passed. You’ve got to find the right balance between proactivity and giving people space.

I always like to ask at the outset, what have we got to do to win the business? That question usually gets a great reaction and gives you the information you need to know.

As you know there are so many modes of communication today. For example, In-person, phone calls, video calls, emails, and text messages. In your opinion, which of these communication methods should be avoided when attempting to close a sale or follow up? Which are the best ones? Can you explain or give a story?

All of them! They are key tools in your toolkit of methods that you can use to engage customers. Knowing when and how to deploy is down to your judgment of the situation. Most people will not meet face to face anymore, so you have to build up to that via calls, emails and video calls. However, there is no substitute for being sat in a room with your clients so always be on the lookout for those opportunities. Overall, try to keep as much control of the process as possible. Always have something going in the diary for you and the client to engage.

Ok, we are nearly done. Here is our final “meaty” question. You are a person of enormous influence. If you could inspire a movement that would bring the most amount of good to the greatest amount of people, what would that be? You never know what your idea can trigger.

Creativity can solve almost any problem. There are a lot of problems that need solving in the world right now. So I’d like to inspire more people to tap into the inherent creativity that everyone has at some level. Then channel that creative energy into solving problems and having fun, whether in business or their personal life. After all Albert Einstein famously said “creativity is intelligence having fun”.

How can our readers follow you online?

You can check out the new book Selling Creativity, my business website www.theclientkey.com or LinkedIn and Instagram.

Thank you!

Thank you for the interview. We wish you only continued success!